Well I installed the latest Unbuntu 11.10 or something like that, now here is where I'm going to start this small rant.

Well I had no idea that having a High Speed connection would be required, but hey, can't win them all. Now after I did the installation Ubuntu did not recognize any hardware outside of my monitor. It didn't see my ATI card, it didn't see my internal Modem which of course I need to start downloading what software it is looking for. It did however install it's own drivers for my sound, mind you I didn't mind the driver it did install...I need the modem to work.

My point here is that any Linux OS should have all the drivers possible, and have a better detection system in place instead of forcing someone to download what should be in teh initial package.

I did install it in VMware prior to doing a full install, and it worked well enough, but the real hangup I had was when it started to download the bloody language files (what the hell is up with that anyway, I'm english). I was able to download all the other drivers without too much trouble but I had to skip the language files. Of course having it work in VMware is not where I wanted to go.

As far as initial driver base, Windows wins hands down...All I see is Betamax vs VHS, and like VHS (inferior product) Windows will always win.... I wish it wasn't that way, I do want to get a full working copy of linux installed, and so far it's pretty much pointless since it doesn't recognize hardware properly.

Mind you I could be horribly wrong, but from what I have experienced so far I can see why very few use the OS...to bad it is superior.


---
■ Synchronet ■ Paranor BBS 1989-2011(revived). telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23 Website: http://www.j

Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

Well I installed the latest Unbuntu 11.10 or something like that, now here where I'm going to start this small rant.

Well I had no idea that having a High Speed connection would be required, b hey, can't win them all. Now after I did the installation Ubuntu did not recognize any hardware outside of my monitor. It didn't see my ATI card, it didn't see my internal Modem which of course I need to start downloading wha software it is looking for. It did however install it's own drivers for my sound, mind you I didn't mind the driver it did install...I need the modem t work.

My point here is that any Linux OS should have all the drivers possible, an have a better detection system in place instead of forcing someone to downlo what should be in teh initial package.

I did install it in VMware prior to doing a full install, and it worked wel enough, but the real hangup I had was when it started to download the bloody language files (what the hell is up with that anyway, I'm english). I was ab to download all the other drivers without too much trouble but I had to skip the language files. Of course having it work in VMware is not where I wanted go.

As far as initial driver base, Windows wins hands down...All I see is Betam vs VHS, and like VHS (inferior product) Windows will always win.... I wish i wasn't that way, I do want to get a full working copy of linux installed, an so far it's pretty much pointless since it doesn't recognize hardware proper

Mind you I could be horribly wrong, but from what I have experienced so far can see why very few use the OS...to bad it is superior.

Bit of bad luck about the drivers. I had no issues whatsoever, but I don't have an internal modem, I access the internet through the network card.
Ironic thing is, that Linux does include most drivers with the kernel, unlike Windows where they are seperate.

What hardware specifically, are you having trouble with? Once you get the hardware up and running, its pretty smooth from there.

---
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Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

As far as initial driver base, Windows wins hands down...All I see is Betamax vs VHS, and like VHS (inferior product) Windows will always win....

You could put a whole movie on a single VHS tape or record a hockey game, and you could buy porn on VHS.

I don't see how VHS is inferior... it seems to be the only one that gets the job done.

---
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Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Deuce to Mikesla on Thu Nov 10 2011 09:58 am

Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

As far as initial driver base, Windows wins hands down...All I see is Betamax vs VHS, and like VHS (inferior product) Windows will always win..

You could put a whole movie on a single VHS tape or record a hockey game, an you could buy porn on VHS.

I don't see how VHS is inferior... it seems to be the only one that gets the job done.

beatmax had more compression.

"Practise safe Lunch, Use a Condiment"


---
■ Synchronet ■ Three Stooges Gentlemens Club - Las Vegas, Nv - tsgc.dyndns.org

Boraxman wrote to Mikesla <=-

Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

Well I installed the latest Unbuntu 11.10 or something like that, now here where I'm going to start this small rant.

Well I had no idea that having a High Speed connection would be required, b hey, can't win them all. Now after I did the installation Ubuntu did not recognize any hardware outside of my monitor. It didn't see my ATI card, it didn't see my internal Modem which of course I need to start downloading wha software it is looking for. It did however install it's own drivers for my sound, mind you I didn't mind the driver it did install...I need the modem t work.

My point here is that any Linux OS should have all the drivers possible, an have a better detection system in place instead of forcing someone to downlo what should be in teh initial package.

I did install it in VMware prior to doing a full install, and it worked wel enough, but the real hangup I had was when it started to download the bloody language files (what the hell is up with that anyway, I'm english). I was ab to download all the other drivers without too much trouble but I had to skip the language files. Of course having it work in VMware is not where I wanted go.

As far as initial driver base, Windows wins hands down...All I see is Betam vs VHS, and like VHS (inferior product) Windows will always win.... I wish i wasn't that way, I do want to get a full working copy of linux installed, an so far it's pretty much pointless since it doesn't recognize hardware proper

Mind you I could be horribly wrong, but from what I have experienced so far can see why very few use the OS...to bad it is superior.

Bit of bad luck about the drivers. I had no issues whatsoever, but I don't have an internal modem, I access the internet through the network card. Ironic thing is, that Linux does include most drivers with the kernel, unlike Windows where they are seperate.

What hardware specifically, are you having trouble with? Once you get
the hardware up and running, its pretty smooth from there.

There are two problems that I need to address right away before I can go any further...

1st Problem: How do I get root admission (I'm already admin). I have tried the old
root as the name, and of root as the password but that of course would override the
security features if it was that easy.

2nd: Most important of all I have an internal supramax v.92 modem, and I don't even know where to begin to set this up. I have already searched all over the place looking for Linux drivers, and there is nothing around for it.

Unfortunately I have a Nezero account, and I did do some reading up on this (netzero), and I hope I found the solution to my problem
( I downloaded something called "netzero.deb", I used Windows for downloading the driver).

I have used the xterm program to access the shell, and entered sh, and when
I try to enter any command like ./ it tells me that I don't have permission which brings
me back to problem number 1.

It's mostly my modem, and netzero that concernes me, once I can figure that out everything
else will fall in to place for me as I can then just take my time in downloading the files
I need such as opengl extensions, and eventually wine.

I have heard only good things about Linux, and I'm not going to give up on it just because
I have to start from scratch.

Cheers.

------------------------
Paranor BBS: telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23
Website: http://www.justallinone.com
Jaio Newsgroup Forum: http://usenet.justallinone.com
------------------------
... Mikesla uses Multi-Mail, should you? Probably not...
--- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
■ Synchronet ■ Paranor BBS 1989-2011(revived). telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23 Website: http://www.j

Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Deuce to Mikesla on Thu Nov 10 2011 09:58 am

As far as initial driver base, Windows wins hands down...All I see is Betamax vs VHS, and like VHS (inferior product) Windows will always win..

You could put a whole movie on a single VHS tape or record a hockey game, an you could buy porn on VHS.

I don't see how VHS is inferior... it seems to be the only one that gets the job done.

It's funny that after all these years, the Sony vs. The World battle still rages on. Oddly enough, the open standards were damn near identical in quality to Sony's offerings in their initial iteration (this goes to Beta/VHS and HD-DVD/Blu-ray).

In a way, though, I'm glad Sony won the 2nd gen DVD format war. I think their licensing slowed down adoption and helped the push for streaming media.

Rev


---
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Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

My point here is that any Linux OS should have all the drivers possible, an have a better detection system in place instead of forcing someone to downlo what should be in teh initial package.

Did you download the right medium? If you downloaded a network install or a small CD, yes, everything will need to be downloaded off the internet. In order to do a "networkless" install, you would have to get the DVD of whatever distro you want to install.

A full Ubuntu desktop with all your needed drivers, along with everyone else's, would not fit on a 700mb CD or USB stick. Windows doesn't either.

--
axisd

---
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Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Reverend Shaft to Deuce on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:57 pm

It's funny that after all these years, the Sony vs. The World battle still rages on. Oddly enough, the open standards were damn near identical in quality to Sony's offerings in their initial iteration (this goes to Beta/VHS and HD-DVD/Blu-ray).

Well, the initial iteration of Betamax absolutely had better chroma resolution - no doubt about that... but you couldn't put a movie on one and you couldn't record anything over an hour either. It doesn't matter how nice the pictures are if they're not the ones you want to look at.

The Betamax failed because Sony simply didn't understand the market - VHS was the only choice that filled the uses people wanted.

---
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Access Denied wrote to Mikesla <=-

Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

My point here is that any Linux OS should have all the drivers possible, an have a better detection system in place instead of forcing someone to downlo what should be in teh initial package.

Did you download the right medium? If you downloaded a network install
or a small CD, yes, everything will need to be downloaded off the internet. In order to do a "networkless" install, you would have to get the DVD of whatever distro you want to install.

A full Ubuntu desktop with all your needed drivers, along with everyone else's, would not fit on a 700mb CD or USB stick. Windows doesn't
either.

My brother downloaded the latest release (v11.10) which is about 700 megs.
I did think that was a bit small for a full operating system but then again
I don't know anything about linux. I did take a quick look around to see if there were other much larger bundled Ubuntu packages but I didn't see any
so I thought I was getting the full package. Thats my fault I should have
stuck with my first impression, and hunted for the full package.

Mind you my earlier rant was about how different Linux, and Windows are
and boy you can't get much more different between these two os's.

The only real problem that is stopping me from doing a full install is trying to figure out a fatal error I had while trying install modem drivers.


------------------------
Paranor BBS: telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23
Website: http://www.justallinone.com
Jaio Newsgroup Forum: http://usenet.justallinone.com
------------------------
... Just because it's a right doesn't make it right.
--- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
■ Synchronet ■ Paranor BBS 1989-2011(revived). telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23 Website: http://www.j

Re: Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to Boraxman on Thu Nov 10 2011 07:16 pm

Boraxman wrote to Mikesla <=-

Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

Well I installed the latest Unbuntu 11.10 or something like that, now he where I'm going to start this small rant.

Well I had no idea that having a High Speed connection would be required hey, can't win them all. Now after I did the installation Ubuntu did not recognize any hardware outside of my monitor. It didn't see my ATI card, didn't see my internal Modem which of course I need to start downloading software it is looking for. It did however install it's own drivers for m sound, mind you I didn't mind the driver it did install...I need the mode work.

My point here is that any Linux OS should have all the drivers possible, have a better detection system in place instead of forcing someone to dow what should be in teh initial package.

I did install it in VMware prior to doing a full install, and it worked enough, but the real hangup I had was when it started to download the blo language files (what the hell is up with that anyway, I'm english). I was to download all the other drivers without too much trouble but I had to s the language files. Of course having it work in VMware is not where I wan go.

As far as initial driver base, Windows wins hands down...All I see is Be vs VHS, and like VHS (inferior product) Windows will always win.... I wis wasn't that way, I do want to get a full working copy of linux installed, so far it's pretty much pointless since it doesn't recognize hardware pro

Mind you I could be horribly wrong, but from what I have experienced so can see why very few use the OS...to bad it is superior.

Bit of bad luck about the drivers. I had no issues whatsoever, but I don't have an internal modem, I access the internet through the network card. Ironic thing is, that Linux does include most drivers with the kernel, unlike Windows where they are seperate.

What hardware specifically, are you having trouble with? Once you get the hardware up and running, its pretty smooth from there.

There are two problems that I need to address right away before I can go an further...

1st Problem: How do I get root admission (I'm already admin). I have tried old
root as the name, and of root as the password but that of course would overr the
security features if it was that easy.

2nd: Most important of all I have an internal supramax v.92 modem, and I don even know where to begin to set this up. I have already searched all over th place looking for Linux drivers, and there is nothing around for it.

Unfortunately I have a Nezero account, and I did do some reading up on this (netzero), and I hope I found the solution to my problem
( I downloaded something called "netzero.deb", I used Windows for downloadin the driver).

I have used the xterm program to access the shell, and entered sh, and when I try to enter any command like ./ it tells me that I don't have permission which brings
me back to problem number 1.

It's mostly my modem, and netzero that concernes me, once I can figure that out everything
else will fall in to place for me as I can then just take my time in downloading the files
I need such as opengl extensions, and eventually wine.

I have heard only good things about Linux, and I'm not going to give up on i just because
I have to start from scratch.

Cheers.

------------------------
Paranor BBS: telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23
Website: http://www.justallinone.com
Jaio Newsgroup Forum: http://usenet.justallinone.com ------------------------
... Mikesla uses Multi-Mail, should you? Probably not...

To get root access on the terminal, type "su -" (without the quotes) and enter the password. The root password you would have set up during installation. Note that the root user is the admin user. If you've forgotten it, you can reset it.
As for the modem, I'm not too sure. Sometimes with hardware, its the chipset that is used thats more important than the brand. For instance, the supramax seems to use the Conexant chipset. I used to use an internal modem under Linux with this chipset and it worked OK, so you may be in luck.

Try
www.linuxant.com/drivers
You probably want the HSF Softmodem drivers. Your Ubunto uses the Debian packaging system, but these seem limited.

You can also try
https://help.ubuntu.com/community/DialupModemHowto/Conexant
They have free drivers and instructions. The ones on the Linuxant site I think need registration, but that Ubuntu link seems to have details for a free driver.

---
■ Synchronet ■ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org

Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

but hey, can't win them all. Now after I did the installation Ubuntu did
not recognize any hardware outside of my monitor. It didn't see my ATI
card, it didn't see my internal Modem which of course I need to start downloading what software it is looking for. It did however install it's
own drivers for my sound, mind you I didn't mind the driver it did install...I need the modem to work.

My point here is that any Linux OS should have all the drivers possible, and have a better detection system in place instead of forcing someone to download what should be in teh initial package.

If you think Linux should have all of the drivers, I agree. Go complain to the companies that made your hardware for not releasing drivers for linux, and instead supporting the microsoft stranglehold.

The idea of blaming linux for your hardware being restrictive seems pretty silly. My computer worked right out of the box with Ubuntu, with 0 configuration required...but then, I didn't buy it as some silly Dell package deal, I built it. Consumer laziness has its price.

cykros
Discordia BBS: An apple a day keeps the goddess at play...fnord. telnet://discordia.dyndns.info

---
■ Synchronet ■ Discordia BBS

Cykros wrote to Mikesla <=-

Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to All on Thu Nov 10 2011 04:43 am

but hey, can't win them all. Now after I did the installation Ubuntu did
not recognize any hardware outside of my monitor. It didn't see my ATI
card, it didn't see my internal Modem which of course I need to start downloading what software it is looking for. It did however install it's
own drivers for my sound, mind you I didn't mind the driver it did install...I need the modem to work.

My point here is that any Linux OS should have all the drivers possible, and have a better detection system in place instead of forcing someone to download what should be in teh initial package.

If you think Linux should have all of the drivers, I agree. Go
complain to the companies that made your hardware for not releasing drivers for linux, and instead supporting the microsoft stranglehold.

I know Linux is a superior OS (from what I have read) but without linux building a stronger more versitile driver base they won't really get the backing from the public. The stronger the public support for Linux
the hardware companies will want to pick up their buisness. More users
leads to more hardware being built, and better drivers.

One more thing, you need a masters degree at M.I.T to learn all the commands. Mind you I like it personally, and I know eventually I will enjoy Linux, BUT
if Linux does not get it's act together eventually the user base will not
grow, and give MS a run for their money. Linux is NOT easy, so make it easy
for the normal Joe out there, and people will take it on. I know that there
are people who are trying their best to do this, and I give them credit
for trying.

What would have happened to Windows if Microsoft decided to sell their OS without the installer package installed, but you need the installer to
install your modem drivers to get online? Microsoft would be a DEAD
company, and NO one would buy their product, and that is how I feel at the moment, I can get the the drivers, but I need to be online to get the bloody files (dependencies) installed first before I can compile the modem driver properly which is well stupid.

The idea of blaming linux for your hardware being restrictive seems
pretty silly.

I agree with you to a point. It is up to the companies who sell the Hardware but it's also the responsiblity for those who create a OS to make their OS compatible with what is on the market as well. So both are too blame here.

See there it is, the internal hardware is Conexant chipsets. They have a
a large database of supported linux types, unfortunatly the Ubuntu 11.10 is Oneiric is not supported. BUT, they do have generic drivers which should
work. Here is the problem, since I require to have internet to download Ubuntu's kernel files, and all dependencies, I can't compile for some odd reason the Generic modem drivers which I am pretty sure would work.

Consumer laziness has its price.

Sooooo, true!

------------------------
Paranor BBS: telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23
Website: http://www.justallinone.com
Jaio Newsgroup Forum: http://usenet.justallinone.com
------------------------
... Just because it's a right doesn't make it right.
--- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
■ Synchronet ■ Paranor BBS 1989-2011(revived). telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23 Website: http://www.j

Re: Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to Cykros on Sun Nov 13 2011 09:08 am

I agree with you to a point. It is up to the companies who sell the Hardware but it's also the responsiblity for those who create a OS to make their OS compatible with what is on the market as well. So both are too blame here.

See there it is, the internal hardware is Conexant chipsets. They have a
a large database of supported linux types, unfortunatly the Ubuntu 11.10 is Oneiric is not supported. BUT, they do have generic drivers which should work. Here is the problem, since I require to have internet to download Ubuntu's kernel files, and all dependencies, I can't compile for some odd reason the Generic modem drivers which I am pretty sure would work.

Consumer laziness has its price.

Sooooo, true!

------------------------
Paranor BBS: telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23
Website: http://www.justallinone.com
Jaio Newsgroup Forum: http://usenet.justallinone.com ------------------------
... Just because it's a right doesn't make it right.

Ubuntu 11.10 may not be supported because of the fact its new, and the website might not be updated. There is a problem with Internet distribution you have pointed out, but that would be true for any hardware which is requried for internet access.

But hardware these days comes undocumented. The Sound Blaster in days of yore used to come with a programmers manual. I have a manual for an XT computer which has the BIOS source code and schematics for the machine, enough information to almost let you BUILD a replica.

Now you get little information, which I think is a travesety. As a customer whos purchased a piece of technology, I think I have the right to be able to use it. By denying customers the information they need to program and use it, they are essentially denying use. Let me reiterate, I belive that if you buy a card or device, you should get information on how to operate it, which means to program it. If not in the box, available for download.

If you can't write your own software to utilise it, the product is frankly incomplete and you are being ripped off.

---
■ Synchronet ■ MS & RD BBs - bbs.mozysswamp.org

Boraxman wrote to Mikesla <=-

Re: Re: Lack of Drivers...
By: Mikesla to Cykros on Sun Nov 13 2011 09:08 am

I agree with you to a point. It is up to the companies who sell the Hardware but it's also the responsiblity for those who create a OS to make their OS compatible with what is on the market as well. So both are too blame here.

See there it is, the internal hardware is Conexant chipsets. They have a
a large database of supported linux types, unfortunatly the Ubuntu 11.10 is Oneiric is not supported. BUT, they do have generic drivers which should work. Here is the problem, since I require to have internet to download Ubuntu's kernel files, and all dependencies, I can't compile for some odd reason the Generic modem drivers which I am pretty sure would work.

Consumer laziness has its price.

Sooooo, true!

------------------------
Paranor BBS: telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23
Website: http://www.justallinone.com
Jaio Newsgroup Forum: http://usenet.justallinone.com ------------------------
... Just because it's a right doesn't make it right.

Ubuntu 11.10 may not be supported because of the fact its new, and the website might not be updated. There is a problem with Internet distribution you have pointed out, but that would be true for any
hardware which is requried for internet access.

Oh I know, and I am willing to wait, but I can't understand why this version of Unbuntu is not capable of being backward compatible? All I want to do is install my modem. There are drivers for my modem but for earlier kernel versions.

For instance, My modem only comes with drivers for Win98, WinXP, but with a little
tweaking I have my modem installed, and running beatifully in Windows 7 32 bit, and
I mean working nicely even though the modem is not suppose to be compatible. That is
one of the beautiful aspects of Windows, you can install drivers for hardware made
years before with very little problems.

But hardware these days comes undocumented. The Sound Blaster in days
of yore used to come with a programmers manual. I have a manual for an
XT computer which has the BIOS source code and schematics for the
machine, enough information to almost let you BUILD a replica.

That is very true.

Now you get little information, which I think is a travesety. As a customer whos purchased a piece of technology, I think I have the right
to be able to use it. By denying customers the information they need
to program and use it, they are essentially denying use. Let me reiterate, I belive that if you buy a card or device, you should get information on how to operate it, which means to program it. If not in
the box, available for download.

Again so true. Imagine purchasing a new mother board, and all the documentation is in PDF format.

If you can't write your own software to utilise it, the product is
frankly incomplete and you are being ripped off.

True...

------------------------
Paranor BBS: telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23
Website: http://www.justallinone.com
Jaio Newsgroup Forum: http://usenet.justallinone.com
------------------------
... Mikesla uses Multi-Mail, should you? Probably not...
--- MultiMail/Win32 v0.49
■ Synchronet ■ Paranor BBS 1989-2011(revived). telnet://jaio.no-ip.org:23 Website: http://www.j