It was like crack back then. I remember leeching stuff I would never even use, just because it was registered, shit like Print Shop Deluxe,
CAD, etc.

I would get stuff my PC could not even run. But I would get it anyway. Even when it took 4 hours to DL. lol

HusTler

--- Ezycom V3.00 01FB001F
* Origin: Tiny's BBS - tinysbbs.com (46:1/126)

Re: Re: The future is here
By: Hustler to Metalhead on Tue Jan 08 2019 09:42 am

I would get stuff my PC could not even run. But I would get it anyway. Even when it took 4 hours to DL. lol

I was a CS student, and I recall downloading Microsoft C and taking hours to do so, even though I was using Quick C at the time (and could get Turbo C for dirt cheap at the campus bookstore)

MSC didn't even have an IDE, you had to use an editor that it could pass file locations to.
--- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
* Origin: realitycheckbbs.org -- yesterday's tech today (46:1/115)

Re: Re: The future is here
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Hustler on Tue Jan 08 2019 08:26 am

I was a CS student, and I recall downloading Microsoft C and taking hours to do so, even though I was using Quick C at the time (and could get Turbo C for dirt cheap at the campus bookstore)

I remember hearing about Borland Turbo C and Turbo C++ back in the day. I remember them being fairly popular, and a lot cheaper than the alternatives.
I don't really hear much about Borland anymore, and I'm not sure why they seem to have disappeared from the programming tools market. I suppose Microsoft may have taken advantage of the fact that they produce the dominant OS used in the marketplace and may have enhanced their Visual Studio with their knowledge of Windows that nobody else knows..

Nightfox

On 01/09/19, Nightfox said the following...

I remember hearing about Borland Turbo C and Turbo C++ back in the day.
I remember them being fairly popular, and a lot cheaper than the alternatives. I don't really hear much about Borland anymore, and I'm
not sure why they seem to have disappeared from the programming tools market. I suppose Microsoft may have taken advantage of the fact that they produce the dominant OS used in the marketplace and may have
enhanced their Visual Studio with their knowledge of Windows that nobody else knows..

Believe it or not, Microsoft won in the marketplace by producing
a superior product.

Borland was head and shoulders ahead of MSFT for a long while in
the DOS and Windows 3.1 days. The languages group at Microsoft
was known as something of a backwater at the time, but after an
internal shakeup, the team focused on what would eventually become
Visual Studio and pushed it out as a product. It was a tour de
force, and it was so much better than the competition that it
quickly rose to prominence. Borland just couldn't keep up.

Borland also bifurcated their product offering between Pascal and
C, which was something of a market mistake. The industry wanted
C, not Pascal (which was about education and hobbyists).

It didn't help that MSFT had the dominant PC platform, though
serious technical work wasn't really a PC thing at the time
(high-end workstations and mainframes did the brunt of serious
computing in the 80's and early 90's; the Pentium changed that).

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A39 2018/04/21 (Raspberry Pi/32)
* Origin: ACiD Underworld // blackflag.acid.org:31337 (46:1/204)

tenser, to Nightfox...

I remember hearing about Borland Turbo C and Turbo C++ back in the day.
I remember them being fairly popular, and a lot cheaper than the alternatives. I don't really hear much about Borland anymore, and I'm
not sure why they seem to have disappeared from the programming tools market. I suppose Microsoft may have taken advantage of the fact that they produce the dominant OS used in the marketplace and may have
enhanced their Visual Studio with their knowledge of Windows that nobody else knows..

Believe it or not, Microsoft won in the marketplace by producing
a superior product.

Doesn't surprise me any that Microsoft dominated the software development market. I think that is what they are really good at: software development tools and languages.

-jag
Code it, Script it, Automate it!

... Is using 78 columns safe?
--- MultiMail/DOS v0.51

Re: Re: The future is here
By: tenser to Nightfox on Wed Jan 09 2019 06:17 pm

I remember hearing about Borland Turbo C and Turbo C++ back in the
day. I remember them being fairly popular, and a lot cheaper than
the alternatives. I don't really hear much about Borland anymore,
and I'm not sure why they seem to have disappeared from the
programming tools market. I suppose Microsoft may have taken
advantage of the fact that they produce the dominant OS used in the
marketplace and may have enhanced their Visual Studio with their
knowledge of Windows that nobody else knows..

Believe it or not, Microsoft won in the marketplace by producing
a superior product.

Borland was head and shoulders ahead of MSFT for a long while in
the DOS and Windows 3.1 days. The languages group at Microsoft
was known as something of a backwater at the time, but after an
internal shakeup, the team focused on what would eventually become
Visual Studio and pushed it out as a product. It was a tour de
force, and it was so much better than the competition that it
quickly rose to prominence. Borland just couldn't keep up.

I do tend to like Visual Studio. It's interesting that Microsoft wasn't doing so well in programming tools at the time, because I thought programming tools were one of Microsoft's main products around the time they started.

Similar to how Microsoft makes the most popular programming tools for their own platform, I think it's interesting that Apple and Google are similar. Apple has XCode, which seems popular for their Mac and iOS platforms (perhaps only because XCode supports development for all of Apple's products), and Google has Android Studio for developing Android apps.
Microsoft Visual Studio supports mobile development for Android and iOS now
too though, even in their C# language (I believe). I started looking into using Visual Studio for iOS development, and it requires that you have an actual Mac on your network with the Apple developer tools installed, and Visual Studio uses SSH to communicate with it. I'm not quite sure why they did it that way.. You can use Visual Studio (in Windows) to write apps for iOS, but you still need a Mac to build the app.

Borland also bifurcated their product offering between Pascal and
C, which was something of a market mistake. The industry wanted
C, not Pascal (which was about education and hobbyists).

Yeah, I remember Borland continuing to offer their Pascal developer products. I've never actually worked on a project that used Pascal.. Pascal seemed to be popular for BBS software back in the day though.

Nightfox

Re: Re: The future is here
By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Wed Jan 09 2019 10:11 am

I remember hearing about Borland Turbo C and Turbo C++ back in the day. I remember them being fairly popular, and a lot cheaper than the alternatives. I don't really hear much about Borland anymore, and I'm not sure why they seem to have disappeared from the programming tools market.

There are stories galore of the rise and fall of Borland, and their founder, Philipe Khan. They are still around, I think, making apps for database development.

Sidekick rocked, having a handful of terminate-and-stay-resident tools in DOS made it much more usable.
--- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
* Origin: realitycheckbbs.org -- yesterday's tech today (46:1/115)

Quoting poindexter FORTRAN to Nightfox <=-

Sidekick rocked, having a handful of terminate-and-stay-resident tools
in DOS made it much more usable.

I loved sidekick. Friend of mine was so TSR crazy he had to have a list
printed to remember all the keyboard combo's. Not sure how he got
anything done.

Shawn

... Teacher, may I please be excused? My brain is full.
--- Blue Wave/386
* Origin: A Tiny slice o pi (46:1/126.4)

Re: The future is here
By: Tiny to poindexter FORTRAN on Thu Jan 10 2019 07:38 am

I loved sidekick. Friend of mine was so TSR crazy he had to have a list printed to remember all the keyboard combo's. Not sure how he got
anything done.

Back when I was downloading over 14.4 with Telix, being able to write something in the SK text editor was a lifesaver.

Telemate came around a little later and had some cool built-in apps, but its emulation wasn't as good as Telix (which had scripting) or Procomm Plus (which had scripting and full VT102/VT220 support)

So, I ended up running 3 comm apps.
--- SBBSecho 3.06-Win32
* Origin: realitycheckbbs.org -- yesterday's tech today (46:1/115)

Quoting poindexter FORTRAN to Tiny <=-

Telemate came around a little later and had some cool built-in apps,
but its emulation wasn't as good as Telix (which had scripting) or
Procomm Plus (which had scripting and full VT102/VT220 support)

I ended up just being a Qmodem Pro guy. ;) However waaaay later I did
discover Procomm Plus.

Shawn

... Useless Invention: Remote control for a computer.
--- Blue Wave/386
* Origin: A Tiny slice o pi (46:1/126.4)

Re: The future is here
By: poindexter FORTRAN to Tiny on Thu Jan 10 2019 08:39 am

Back when I was downloading over 14.4 with Telix, being able to write something in the SK text editor was a lifesaver.

Telemate came around a little later and had some cool built-in apps, but its emulation wasn't as good as Telix (which had scripting) or Procomm Plus (which had scripting and full VT102/VT220 support)

I started out with Procomm Plus and thought it was decent. I liked Telix too, though Telemate became my favorite BBS comm app for DOS. I didn't realize its emulation wasn't as good as the other 2, but I don't recall having any problems with Telemate. If I recall, Telemate had scripting too.. I remember making a couple scripts for Telemate to help with some tasks on a couple BBSes.

Nightfox

Re: The future is here
By: Nightfox to poindexter FORTRAN on Sat Jan 12 2019 10:38 pm

I started out with Procomm Plus and thought it was decent. I liked Telix too, though Telemate became my favorite BBS comm app for DOS. I didn't realize its emulation wasn't as good as the other 2, but I don't recall having any problems with Telemate. If I recall, Telemate had scripting too.. I remember making a couple scripts for Telemate to help with some tasks on a couple BBSes.

I was always partial to Terminate. I think I used Telix for awhile before I discovered it, but once Terminate came into the picture, there was no turning back.

DaiTengu

... I stayed in a really old hotel last night. They sent me a wake-up letter. --- SBBSecho 3.06-Linux
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Re: The future is here
By: DaiTengu to Nightfox on Sun Jan 13 2019 08:54 am

I was always partial to Terminate. I think I used Telix for awhile before I discovered it, but once Terminate came into the picture, there was no turning back.

Terminate was the last one I used for DOS. I don't remember using too many of the features, but it was the one all the cool kids were raving about, so I went along with them.

The very last one though was either Telix or Qmodem for Windows. I know I had both installed but just used one, but now I can't remember which. It was probably Qmodem because I also ran Wildcat and was partial to Mustang. Whichever one it was had RIP and that was the only time I ever used that as my default on boards that had it. Looking back, that was probably only for a few months, but it felt like much longer back then.
--- SBBSecho 3.00-Win32
* Origin: The Basement Theory - Sciotoville, Ohio USA (46:1/169)

on 01/11/19, Tiny said...

Quoting poindexter FORTRAN to Tiny <=-

Telemate came around a little later and had some cool built-in apps, but its emulation wasn't as good as Telix (which had scripting) or Procomm Plus (which had scripting and full VT102/VT220 support)

I ended up just being a Qmodem Pro guy. ;) However waaaay later I did
discover Procomm Plus.

In my case it was Procomm Plus -> Commo -> Qmodem Pro -> Telix -> Telemate.

--- Mystic BBS v1.12 A38 2018/01/01 (Windows/32)
* Origin: d i s t o r t i o n // d1st.org (46:1/145)